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	<title>Comments on: AT&amp;T Offering &#8220;Loans&#8221; not &#8220;Subsidies&#8221;?</title>
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	<link>http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2009/06/12/att-offering-loans-subsidies/</link>
	<description>For people who dare to Phone Different.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 09:31:11 -0500</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: chris</title>
		<link>http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2009/06/12/att-offering-loans-subsidies/comment-page-1/#comment-51534</link>
		<dc:creator>chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 17:49:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theiphoneblog.com/?p=9129#comment-51534</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;@Greg&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Just pretend that they are only putting them out every two years. Ignore the 3Gs and when next years phone comes out, get it then. You&#039;re no worse off than if they were only coming out with new models every two years&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Greg</p>

<p>Just pretend that they are only putting them out every two years. Ignore the 3Gs and when next years phone comes out, get it then. You&#8217;re no worse off than if they were only coming out with new models every two years</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: chris</title>
		<link>http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2009/06/12/att-offering-loans-subsidies/comment-page-1/#comment-51533</link>
		<dc:creator>chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 17:41:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theiphoneblog.com/?p=9129#comment-51533</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Not a loan, that&#039;s just silly. The monthly fees don&#039;t change whether you have asubsidized phone or not. If it was a loan, the fees would drop or those without subsidies wouldn&#039;t pay as much.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;It&#039;s so simple, I still can&#039;t fathom why there&#039;s been any debate (other than the passions ignited by those who simply can&#039;t stand the idea of waiting for the latest thing)&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;ATT charges a monthly fee for it&#039;s services. You may buy a full priced phone (or use one you already own) and cancel your service with them at any time. &lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;However, you may want a different, more expensive phone but not have or want to pay the full price. In that case, ATT will take a loss on the sale of the phone in return for your agreement to stay with them at the same monthly rates as everyone else for two years AND forego upgrades during that time. &lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;That&#039;s not a loan, it&#039;s marketing strategy. You get an expensive phone for less. They get your monthly dollars for two years. WIN-WIN.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;And for g-d sakes stop whining if you have to wait - you got your subsidy, saved several hundred bucks and now you just have to wait until 18 months passes since you bought the last phone. Or pay full price, whatever you want to do. No one if forcing anyone to pay anything or do anything.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not a loan, that&#8217;s just silly. The monthly fees don&#8217;t change whether you have asubsidized phone or not. If it was a loan, the fees would drop or those without subsidies wouldn&#8217;t pay as much.</p>

<p>It&#8217;s so simple, I still can&#8217;t fathom why there&#8217;s been any debate (other than the passions ignited by those who simply can&#8217;t stand the idea of waiting for the latest thing)</p>

<p>ATT charges a monthly fee for it&#8217;s services. You may buy a full priced phone (or use one you already own) and cancel your service with them at any time. </p>

<p>However, you may want a different, more expensive phone but not have or want to pay the full price. In that case, ATT will take a loss on the sale of the phone in return for your agreement to stay with them at the same monthly rates as everyone else for two years AND forego upgrades during that time. </p>

<p>That&#8217;s not a loan, it&#8217;s marketing strategy. You get an expensive phone for less. They get your monthly dollars for two years. WIN-WIN.</p>

<p>And for g-d sakes stop whining if you have to wait &#8211; you got your subsidy, saved several hundred bucks and now you just have to wait until 18 months passes since you bought the last phone. Or pay full price, whatever you want to do. No one if forcing anyone to pay anything or do anything.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Greg</title>
		<link>http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2009/06/12/att-offering-loans-subsidies/comment-page-1/#comment-51521</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 16:29:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theiphoneblog.com/?p=9129#comment-51521</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;ATT is full of crap, they know Apple is going to be putting new iphones out each year, why don&#039;t they come out w new phones every 2 years when our contracts are up!!! i bet the sale of the 3gs(ucks) is going to be way down, i was going to pay the $299, but now i think i will just jailbreak my phone, only reason i wanted to buy the new phone anyway was bcuz of the video camera!!!  ATT U R SLIPPING!!!!&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ATT is full of <acronym title="crap">****</acronym>, they know Apple is going to be putting new iphones out each year, why don&#8217;t they come out w new phones every 2 years when our contracts are up!!! i bet the sale of the 3gs(ucks) is going to be way down, i was going to pay the $299, but now i think i will just jailbreak my phone, only reason i wanted to buy the new phone anyway was bcuz of the video camera!!!  ATT U R SLIPPING!!!!</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Jason</title>
		<link>http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2009/06/12/att-offering-loans-subsidies/comment-page-1/#comment-51512</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 15:22:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theiphoneblog.com/?p=9129#comment-51512</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I think people are getting too stuck on the word &quot;loan&quot; as it&#039;s defined by banks (interest, regulation, etc.). I think the point of the article identifies it as a loan in the dictionary-definition sense. They give you money (in this case towards the cost of the phone), and you are expected to repay that over a period of time. That&#039;s a loan, no matter how you slice it. Of course, you&#039;re right that they can&#039;t call it that for legal reasons (and probably PR reasons as well), but in the truest sense of the word, it&#039;s a loan and not a subsidy.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think people are getting too stuck on the word &#8220;loan&#8221; as it&#8217;s defined by banks (interest, regulation, etc.). I think the point of the article identifies it as a loan in the dictionary-definition sense. They give you money (in this case towards the cost of the phone), and you are expected to repay that over a period of time. That&#8217;s a loan, no matter how you slice it. Of course, you&#8217;re right that they can&#8217;t call it that for legal reasons (and probably PR reasons as well), but in the truest sense of the word, it&#8217;s a loan and not a subsidy.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Jason</title>
		<link>http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2009/06/12/att-offering-loans-subsidies/comment-page-1/#comment-51510</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 15:17:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theiphoneblog.com/?p=9129#comment-51510</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;@dmys&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;You could not be more wrong.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;The cost of the iPhone 3G components was $174.33, according to iSupply in a study they did last summer (http://bit.ly/133BQc). They also claim that Apple pays $50 IP royalties for each unit, so the cost of just the unit is $224.33. If Apple did try to sell it at $199 without subsidy, they would lose a LOT of money because that price is only for the assembly. As Gizmodo points out, &quot;This figure does not include additional costs like software development, shipping and distribution, packaging and miscellaneous accessories included with each phone.&quot; It also does not account for the people who work for Apple, the costs of the retail locations, and other expenses associated with running a company. If you take all of that into consideration, I think $699 for a device like the iPhone is a pretty good deal. And unless you&#039;re ready to pay that price, you need the carrier subsidies.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@dmys</p>

<p>You could not be more wrong.</p>

<p>The cost of the iPhone 3G components was $174.33, according to iSupply in a study they did last summer (<a href="http://bit.ly/133BQc)" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/133BQc)</a>. They also claim that Apple pays $50 IP royalties for each unit, so the cost of just the unit is $224.33. If Apple did try to sell it at $199 without subsidy, they would lose a LOT of money because that price is only for the assembly. As Gizmodo points out, &#8220;This figure does not include additional costs like software development, shipping and distribution, packaging and miscellaneous accessories included with each phone.&#8221; It also does not account for the people who work for Apple, the costs of the retail locations, and other expenses associated with running a company. If you take all of that into consideration, I think $699 for a device like the iPhone is a pretty good deal. And unless you&#8217;re ready to pay that price, you need the carrier subsidies.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Michael Brown</title>
		<link>http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2009/06/12/att-offering-loans-subsidies/comment-page-1/#comment-51496</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Brown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 13:39:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theiphoneblog.com/?p=9129#comment-51496</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Calling it a &quot;loan&quot; would subject them to credit regulations and possibly make  AT&amp;T a non-bank bank.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;While I appreciate Apple&#039;s efforts to enhance the product, the i-phone&#039;s main deficiency is the poor quality of AT&amp;T network.  The primary purpose of any cellular phone is to connect two callers - something that continues to challenge AT&amp;T.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Calling it a &#8220;loan&#8221; would subject them to credit regulations and possibly make  AT&amp;T a non-bank bank.</p>

<p>While I appreciate Apple&#8217;s efforts to enhance the product, the i-phone&#8217;s main deficiency is the poor quality of AT&amp;T network.  The primary purpose of any cellular phone is to connect two callers &#8211; something that continues to challenge AT&amp;T.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: PSM</title>
		<link>http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2009/06/12/att-offering-loans-subsidies/comment-page-1/#comment-51495</link>
		<dc:creator>PSM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 12:59:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theiphoneblog.com/?p=9129#comment-51495</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I think part of the confusion is that the Apple and AT&amp;T sites are telling people who are not eligible to upgrade their phones that their only option is to pay $700.  I wrote to AT&amp;T CS about how the pricing worked, and one of the things I was told is that by signing a new 2-year contract I could get the phone for $499, which is not mentioned anywhere when you fill in the form that tells you what your eligibility is.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think part of the confusion is that the Apple and AT&amp;T sites are telling people who are not eligible to upgrade their phones that their only option is to pay $700.  I wrote to AT&amp;T CS about how the pricing worked, and one of the things I was told is that by signing a new 2-year contract I could get the phone for $499, which is not mentioned anywhere when you fill in the form that tells you what your eligibility is.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Chobbs</title>
		<link>http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2009/06/12/att-offering-loans-subsidies/comment-page-1/#comment-51481</link>
		<dc:creator>Chobbs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 09:04:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theiphoneblog.com/?p=9129#comment-51481</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;not a loan.  there is no interest being charged.  no finance contracts.  only a contract to retain the carrier as your provider.  it is just a guarantee that you wont jump ship once AT&amp;T offers you a discounted phone.  discounting the phone eats into profits but if you stay with them a certain amount of time then it&#039;s worth it.  &lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;the fact that there even has to be an article about whether or not this is a loan is evidence enough that people are up in arms and complaining.  This simply should not be.  it is a non issue.  if one is not happy with the terms then find a carrier with terms that you are happy with and do not sign a contract that you are later going to try and complain your way out of. no one is forcing anyone into anything.  they are enticing you with groovy, neat phones but if your a person of character you&#039;ll be able to say NO THANK YOU, if you feel it&#039;s unfair.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>not a loan.  there is no interest being charged.  no finance contracts.  only a contract to retain the carrier as your provider.  it is just a guarantee that you wont jump ship once AT&amp;T offers you a discounted phone.  discounting the phone eats into profits but if you stay with them a certain amount of time then it&#8217;s worth it.  </p>

<p>the fact that there even has to be an article about whether or not this is a loan is evidence enough that people are up in arms and complaining.  This simply should not be.  it is a non issue.  if one is not happy with the terms then find a carrier with terms that you are happy with and do not sign a contract that you are later going to try and complain your way out of. no one is forcing anyone into anything.  they are enticing you with groovy, neat phones but if your a person of character you&#8217;ll be able to say NO THANK YOU, if you feel it&#8217;s unfair.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: mike mike</title>
		<link>http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2009/06/12/att-offering-loans-subsidies/comment-page-1/#comment-51472</link>
		<dc:creator>mike mike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 06:34:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theiphoneblog.com/?p=9129#comment-51472</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;OK, so what if you have an iPhone for 3 months with at&amp;t and cancel, sell your phone on EBAY for $500?  Is at&amp;t really getting its money back?  If the are subsidizing the iphone $400 off the actual cost, how is it that at&amp;t is making the killing within the first year?  How many people that you know have sold an iPhone (I know more than a few)?  I think you&#039;re flawed, otherwise at&amp;t would have had much more profit than 12-13 billion last year.  What are Apple&#039;s number in comparison?  Why is Verizon better if a blackberry with 450 minutes, unlimited text and unlimited data is $10 more than an iPhone with the same stuff?&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Blogs are beginning to suck...MM&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OK, so what if you have an iPhone for 3 months with at&amp;t and cancel, sell your phone on EBAY for $500?  Is at&amp;t really getting its money back?  If the are subsidizing the iphone $400 off the actual cost, how is it that at&amp;t is making the killing within the first year?  How many people that you know have sold an iPhone (I know more than a few)?  I think you&#8217;re flawed, otherwise at&amp;t would have had much more profit than 12-13 billion last year.  What are Apple&#8217;s number in comparison?  Why is Verizon better if a blackberry with 450 minutes, unlimited text and unlimited data is $10 more than an iPhone with the same stuff?</p>

<p>Blogs are beginning to suck&#8230;MM</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Dmys</title>
		<link>http://www.theiphoneblog.com/2009/06/12/att-offering-loans-subsidies/comment-page-1/#comment-51466</link>
		<dc:creator>Dmys</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 05:01:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theiphoneblog.com/?p=9129#comment-51466</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;My mistake on price on that, it says 250 to make, that doesn&#039;t seem right though, I remember seeing it arond 30, 27 dollar and some cents to be exact.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My mistake on price on that, it says 250 to make, that doesn&#8217;t seem right though, I remember seeing it arond 30, 27 dollar and some cents to be exact.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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